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shzin
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 3
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 Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 9:32 am Post subject: need help with hybrid time/event based dkp system |
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my WoW guild uses the following system for AQ40:
Skeram, Bug Trio, Sartura, Fankriss = 2 dkp per kill
HuHu, Viscidous, TE, C'thun, Ouro = 3 dkp per kill
3 dkp per hr after Fankriss
2 dkp bonus for staying in the raid from start to finish
As you can probably see, with this system we are in adjustment hell with people coming and going all the time, and i am deseperately trying to find a way to automate updating our dkp.
I was wondering if there is anyway to set up the program to reward 2 dkp per boss kill until fankris dies and then 3 dkp per hr and 3 dkp for subsequent boss kills.
Also, we use 15 min intervals to reward dkp in half hour increments, so if someone is in the raid for 15-45 min they get 1.5 dkp, less than 15 min they get none, and more than 45 min they get the whole 3 dkp. I need help on how to set up the interval padding settings to automate this as well.
Thanks for the awesome program, hopefully I can make it work for us because updating our dkp is a full time job. Our dkp host charges $20 to install your plug-in (version 1.2.5a by the way, not sure if that's going to be a problem, I can ask them to install the latest if necessary), and I would like to make sure our dkp system is be compatible before I pay them.
edit:
at this point I would even settle configuring for 3 dkp per hour and per boss, then manually deleting the hourly bonus up to Fankriss' death and lowering the boss kill bonus on the first 4 boss events down to 2 inside the program itself after I parse from raidtracker. this possible to do efficiently to the raid as a whole? |
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Lokorin
Site Admin
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 697
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| Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: need help with hybrid time/event based dkp system |
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It won't entirely map automatically, some manual work will be needed every time to get it to fit exactly.
| shzin wrote: |
Skeram, Bug Trio, Sartura, Fankriss = 2 dkp per kill
HuHu, Viscidous, TE, C'thun, Ouro = 3 dkp per kill |
I'm assuming that you're using CT RaidTacker with /oldformat set to 0 and the corresponding pattern set. In that case every boss kill will show up as an event. The program by default saves previously entered DKP values, so you will just have to enter the values once per boss, then they will be entered automatically whenever the boss is found in a future raid.
| Quote: |
| 3 dkp per hr after Fankriss |
3 DKP per hour is done by entering appropriate values as default DKP bonus per participant and reward interval size. For example 3 and 60 or 1.5 and 30.
This is the one that will require some manual work. By default the reward intervals are created to cover the whole raid. You will have to manually delete some of those create reward intervals and possibly change some of the existing so that they cover the time after Fankriss. There is currently no way to automate it (although it could probably be suggested for a future version).
If you do not use zero-sum then you can get around some of the manual labor by setting the reward of the reward intervals prior to Frankriss to 0 and unchecking the upload reward intervals with reward equal to 0 checkbox. That will cause those intervals to be effectivly removed. You can get some of that automatically by guessing the number of reward intervals prior to Frankriss and then using the DKP bonus per participant (from first) to set an appriopriate amount of the starting reward intervals to 0. That way you might only have to change a couple of values manually each raid.
| Quote: |
| 2 dkp bonus for staying in the raid from start to finish |
This can be done with the high participation threshold and bonus options. Set the threshold to "100" and the bonus to "2".
| Quote: |
| Also, we use 15 min intervals to reward dkp in half hour increments, so if someone is in the raid for 15-45 min they get 1.5 dkp, less than 15 min they get none, and more than 45 min they get the whole 3 dkp. I need help on how to set up the interval padding settings to automate this as well. |
If I understand you correctly then that will not map completely, but something close to it can be done. If you use 30 minute reward intervals (and reward of 1.5 DKP) with a reward interval padding of 450 (7.5 minutes) then a well timed join can result in 1.5 DKP in 15 minutes (but less than 15 minutes is guaranteed to result in no DKP) and 3 DKP would require staying 45 minutes. This depends on when the reward intervals end and start though. If a reward interval starts at 10:00 then it will last until 10:30 and the next is 10:30 to 11:00 then anyone present at 10:7:30 and 10:22:30 will be considered present in the first reward interval and will receive 1.5 DKP. Anyone present at 10:37:30 and 10:52:30 will be considered present in the second reward interval and get another 1.5 DKP. Hence someone joining at 10:00 will not get 1.5 DKP until 10:22:30, which will add up to 3 DKP at 10:52:30, hence not being exactly what you described. Tweaking the reward interval sizes and interval padding can give you something that's fairly similar in practice though.
| Quote: |
| Our dkp host charges $20 to install your plug-in (version 1.2.5a by the way, not sure if that's going to be a problem, I can ask them to install the latest if necessary), and I would like to make sure our dkp system is be compatible before I pay them. |
$20 sounds like an awful lot of money for that (installing it is nothing more than moving a directory from one place to another). So I would start by suggesting to try to do it yourself if you're allowed FTP access. For that kind of money I would most certainly demand to get the latest version of the plugin (currently 1.3.2a in the download section) installed as otherwise you will miss out on a bunch of functionality, the most important probably being different ways to represent the raid on the server. |
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shzin
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, thank you very much for the fast and extensive response. Based on your answers I think I can make this work for us as soon as that plug-in gets uploaded (I know installing it is arbitrary but dkp-hosting.com doesn't give out FTP access ), and I will definitely demand the latest version installed. I kinda inherited this crazy dkp system and its been so long that now we're kinda stuck with it so thank you allowing us to speed it up.
We do not use zero-sum so I will do as you suggested to eliminate the intervals for which we don't award hourly dkp. It takes us about 1hr to kill fankriss so I can set "DKP bonus per participant (from first)" to 0,0 and then only have to manually edit 1 or 2 values like you suggested (great feature). The 7.5 min padding setting for the hourly dkp bonus is definitely close enough to our system and I will use that as well.
I have a couple of more questions if you don't mind.
For BWL and Naxx we have different DKP rules (for example BWL has no hourly bonus and each boss is 1 dkp and Nef is 2). After I set up the parser for AQ40 rules can I export the configuration to a file and then load it before I'm about to parse an AQ40 raid (could i do this for bwl and naxx as well, and will the program still remember boss-kill values across the board)?.
Regarding the "high participation bonus", is this measured from the instant the raid is created to when it is disbanded? our invites go out at 6 and half of the bonus goes out at 6:30 when we are buffed and ready to pull, the other half goes to those who never leave the raid and stay until the end. I can manually start the RaidTracker log at 6:30 to award "on-time" bonus (how would i configure this by the way), but do we have to disband the raid at the end while its is still full (people always drop group the second the raid is over) for the "high participation bonus" to be logged correctly? I would't want someone who stayed for the whole raid but manually dropped group to miss their bonus. I guess I could just manually stop CTRT when the last boss dies or the raid is called.
We are using the latest moddified CTRaidTracker (1.25.13) with "/oldformat 0". In the parser, do i select pattern "CTRT /oldformat 0 regular" or "CTRT /oldformat 0 boss kills as events"?
We use the "Inverted Individual Adjustments" method so I guess thats why you suggested getting the latest version of the plug-in.
Bonus is recorded as a separate raid, whoever was on time gets the whole bonus then negative adjustments for those who leave early (half for being on time and the other half for not leaving). I personally think this is crazy and i would much rather use something simpler, such as separate on-time and high-participation bonuses being individual adjustments and counting toward the total value of the raid. (how do i set this up?)
How do I make sure that raids that get uploaded to eqdkp go under the same event name that we have been using so far(for raid attendance tracking and other statistics). Do I have to edit the names of our events in EQDKP to what CTRT will be calling them so when the raid is parsed and uploaded to the server the raid goes under the same event name as all the previous raids of that instance? for example AQ40: CTRT calls it "Ahn'Qiraj Temple", but the name of the event in our EQKDKP (for which we have months' worth of statistics) is "Ahn'Qiraj 40". When I parse and upload an aq40 raid to eqdkp with your program, will it create a new event called "Ahn'Qiraj Temple", and if I rename our current aq40 event to that name, will the raid be uploaded under that existing name? Maybe i'm not explaing this very well, but I want to preserve our statistics under the same event name, so that when we need to check someone's raid attendace for aq40, we dont have to look at 2 separate events (we also look at adjustments to find out who has a habbit of leaving early).
Lastly regarding loot, when someone wins an item, it is entered manually right away on the dkp site so that person can't bid what they don't have later in the same raid. This eliminates the need for the parser to even deal with loot at all, how how do i set it up to disegard it completely (I would rather not disable loot tracking in CTRT, but it will if i have to).
Sorry about the wall of text, but i was totally clueless about this parser until last night and I'm trying to keep up with all the information at hand.
our dkp site is http://www.dkp-hosting.com/dkp/myst
Thank you again. |
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Lokorin
Site Admin
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 697
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| Posted: Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| shzin wrote: |
| For BWL and Naxx we have different DKP rules (for example BWL has no hourly bonus and each boss is 1 dkp and Nef is 2). After I set up the parser for AQ40 rules can I export the configuration to a file and then load it before I'm about to parse an AQ40 raid (could i do this for bwl and naxx as well, and will the program still remember boss-kill values across the board)?. |
Yes, you can use export and import menus to export an import configurations from files. The boss-kill values are handled by a separate system, so it will still remember the values regardless of which configuration you're using.
| Quote: |
| Regarding the "high participation bonus", is this measured from the instant the raid is created to when it is disbanded? our invites go out at 6 and half of the bonus goes out at 6:30 when we are buffed and ready to pull, the other half goes to those who never leave the raid and stay until the end. I can manually start the RaidTracker log at 6:30 to award "on-time" bonus (how would i configure this by the way), but do we have to disband the raid at the end while its is still full (people always drop group the second the raid is over) for the "high participation bonus" to be logged correctly? I would't want someone who stayed for the whole raid but manually dropped group to miss their bonus. I guess I could just manually stop CTRT when the last boss dies or the raid is called. |
The participation is measured from the point in time when CT RT says that the raid started to the point in time it says that the raid ended. I'm not sure if those two values can be modified through CT RaidTracker.
| Quote: |
| We are using the latest moddified CTRaidTracker (1.25.13) with "/oldformat 0". In the parser, do i select pattern "CTRT /oldformat 0 regular" or "CTRT /oldformat 0 boss kills as events"? |
You want to track boss kills, so "CTRT /oldformat 0 boss kills as events" would be the way to go.
| Quote: |
We use the "Inverted Individual Adjustments" method so I guess thats why you suggested getting the latest version of the plug-in.
Bonus is recorded as a separate raid, whoever was on time gets the whole bonus then negative adjustments for those who leave early (half for being on time and the other half for not leaving). I personally think this is crazy and i would much rather use something simpler, such as separate on-time and high-participation bonuses being individual adjustments and counting toward the total value of the raid. (how do i set this up?) |
To display the high participation bonus as an individual adjustment you could set the high participation bonus representation to "Individual adjustment". If both reward intervals and events are displayed as inverted individual adjustments then it would be hard to represent an on time bonus (which could be an event or a bonus to the first reward interval) in another way.
| Quote: |
| How do I make sure that raids that get uploaded to eqdkp go under the same event name that we have been using so far(for raid attendance tracking and other statistics). Do I have to edit the names of our events in EQDKP to what CTRT will be calling them so when the raid is parsed and uploaded to the server the raid goes under the same event name as all the previous raids of that instance? for example AQ40: CTRT calls it "Ahn'Qiraj Temple", but the name of the event in our EQKDKP (for which we have months' worth of statistics) is "Ahn'Qiraj 40". When I parse and upload an aq40 raid to eqdkp with your program, will it create a new event called "Ahn'Qiraj Temple", and if I rename our current aq40 event to that name, will the raid be uploaded under that existing name? Maybe i'm not explaing this very well, but I want to preserve our statistics under the same event name, so that when we need to check someone's raid attendace for aq40, we dont have to look at 2 separate events (we also look at adjustments to find out who has a habbit of leaving early). |
So the three ways of doing this are
1. Rename the event in EQDKP (I'm not sure how easy this is).
2. Rename every raid in CT RT prior to parsing the log.
3. Change the raid-name in DKP Log Parser after parsing each log (make sure to check the "use global raid names" checkbox if the entire raid should share the same name).
The raid name displayed for each reward interval determins the event name that is used in EQDKP. If the event name does not exist then a new one is created, otherwise the old one is used.
| Quote: |
| Lastly regarding loot, when someone wins an item, it is entered manually right away on the dkp site so that person can't bid what they don't have later in the same raid. This eliminates the need for the parser to even deal with loot at all, how how do i set it up to disegard it completely (I would rather not disable loot tracking in CTRT, but it will if i have to). |
Open the configuration dialog, go to "Parsing"->"Patterns"->"Join/Leave". Scroll down until you see "Loot pattern" and "Loot format", empty those two fields. |
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shzin
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Wed Sep 13, 2006 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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I orderded your plug-in istalled this morning, this is going to do wonders for our dkp. Thank you so much for all the help. |
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